| By Cindy Procter-King | July 1, 2009 |
Today’s Canada Day. Happy Canada Day to me! Seeing as I’m Canadian and this is my inaugural post with Nobody Writes It Better, I’m giving away a trade paperback copy of my Canadian-set romantic comedy, HEAD OVER HEELS. To enter, please leave a comment pertinent to the discussion and check back tomorrow morning to find out if you’ve won.
Going with the Canada Day theme, I thought I’d talk about romance novels set outside the United States. When I began writing romance back in the Dark Ages (ie. pre-Internet), it never occurred to me not to set my stories in my own country. Write what you know, right? I wrote four novels, two of which shall never be published (please, nobody find them once I’ve departed from this earth and publish them—it’ll just embarrass me and then I’ll have to haunt you) before learning that it’s much more difficult to sell stories set outside the U.S. to an American publisher (or even a Canadian publisher like Harlequin in Toronto with a massive U.S. readership), unless they’re historicals set in England or Scotland. That in general American readers don’t want to read stories set outside the States, so I was just shooting myself in the keyboard by continuing to place my books in my own country. At one writing conference, an agent interrupted my pitch two sentences in to ask if I could change the setting from Vancouver to Seattle because otherwise the book would never sell. And I heard the same advice over and over from more seasoned writers. Ironically, my first (and former) agent signed me because she thought my Canadian settings were fresh and different.
What’s a polite, little Canadian writer to do?
I decided to compromise. HEAD OVER HEELS takes place in Vancouver and Whistler, British Columbia, while BORROWING ALEX occurs in Seattle and on fictional Lake Eden. I also write erotic romance under a pen name. So far, I’ve sold three novellas. The first two are set in Calgary, Alberta and Victoria, B.C., and the third is set in L.A. “Penny” (my pen name, get it?) (collective groan) is currently writing the first of an erotic short story series set in Vancouver. Apparently, she’s not very smart, because she totally does not get this “set it in the States” thing. Luckily, her editors don’t seem to mind (phew).
Despite the “rule” not to set romance novels outside the U.S., aside from the agent I pitched to at that conference, no editor or agent has ever told me that they’re rejecting a story because of the setting. Maybe they are, but they don’t tell me so. Lately, I’ve noticed that more and more romance novels written by Canadian authors are getting set outside the U.S. So maybe the wall, if it ever existed, is breaking down.
Blog readers, what do you think? Do you like to read contemporary romance novels set in Canada? How about Australia? New Zealand? Why or why not? (I’m honestly interested. I won’t berate you if you hate reading about litres of milk and how 40 degrees Celsius is scathingly hot when to Americans it sounds slightly above freezing). (36 degrees Celsius is around 100 degrees Fahrenheit, I think). (See how handy I am? I taught you something).
If you’re interested in checking out more Canadian romance authors, some of whom have set novels in the Great White North, visit these ladies: Jo Beverly, Opal Carew, Eileen Cook, Laura Drewry, Bonnie Edwards, Susan Lyons, Lee McKenzie, Kayla Perrin, Wendy Roberts, Kate St. James, Nancy Warren, and Loreth Anne White. And tell them I sent you!
July 1st, 2009 at 5:14 am
Hi Cindy,
Your blog made me prick up my ears. I am an English writer (half Italian!) but have lived in Switzerland all my life. I set my first novel,”Mucho Caliente! – Wish upon a Latino Superstar”, a romantic comedy, ” in Ibiza (Balearic Islands, Spain). My former agent had a lot of interest in it, but none of the publishers were willing to take a chance on it. In the UK my book seemed to be considered too “European”, and in the US, too British. Last year I finally sold it to small press and have had excellent reviews, as well as good feedback from readers in general. American readers seem to appreciate the “exotic” setting (and the fizzy story!), while Europeans enjoy reading a funny love story set on an island with…quite a reputation! My second book is again set neither in the US or the UK…we’ll see how that goes. There’s an interesting article on Dear Author today about the lack of romance novels set outside of the US or the UK, so maybe global awareness is finally also growing in the realm of romance novels.
Thanks for writing about this.
xx Francesca
July 1st, 2009 at 5:43 am
Many, many, many years ago, my mother and I always bought the Harlequins that were set in Australia, New Zealand, England, etc., before we bought any that were in the “boring”, aka known, USA. We always thought those were the best stories. I think I still have some of the very best ones stored in the attic. So, yes, I like stories set in other countries.
July 1st, 2009 at 9:17 am
Add me to those who really like ‘foreign’ settings. I visited British Columbia, and Australia (as well as England and Scotland). Stories set there remind of the great times I’ve had traveling. And it’s fun to go ‘traveling’ again.
Keep jumping back across the border of the US and Canada, eh? Which reminds me to send a happy Canada Day greeting to my sister-in-law, who was born in Victoria.
July 1st, 2009 at 9:41 am
I read a Blaze that was set in Australia, but nothing about it seemed Aussie, not that I’ve ever been there. They lived in a villa (I guess you could live in a villa anywhere). Their speech wasn’t particularly Australian. There was no reason why it needed to be in Australia, but no reason why not. The entire book was set in their villa. It all struck me very odd, and bothered me. I wanted to be swept away to an exotic place, and I wasn’t.
July 1st, 2009 at 9:48 am
Hi Francesca,
I’ll have to check out that article on Dear Author. Thanks for telling me about it.
I used to write all my books in Canadian (Canadian spelling and vernacular). Now I write them using American spelling, even if they’re set in Canada. I’m targeting American publishers and a largely American audience, so it makes sense. I also try not to use words that might confuse Americans. Like, I won’t refer to the weather in Celsius. Instead, I’ll compare the level of heat or cold to something else. However, if I’m writing something like, “Johnny was in grade two,” I don’t translate to “Johnny was in second grade,” because it’s easy to understand what I mean.
Thanks for coming by!
July 1st, 2009 at 9:50 am
Hi Linda,
Yes, many, MANY years ago there weren’t ANY category romances set in the States–or Canada. Not in North America at all. That all changed, and the readership grew like blazes as a result. I love romances set in the States myself, but I always get a kick when I read one set in Canada, especially if I recognize the setting.
July 1st, 2009 at 9:51 am
Terry, I went to university in Victoria. LOVE it there. Never wanted to leave. I will keep jumping back and forth across the border, don’t fear!
July 1st, 2009 at 9:54 am
Hi Kelly,
Wow, that’s an odd reading experience. My dh has Australian cousins, and there’s so much about them and their country that is unique and interesting to North American readers. In my part of Canada, you would never live in a villa, just a plain ol’ house. You might have a cabin on the lake or ski mountain, no matter how big it is, it’s usually referred to as a cabin. However, in Ontario, the same lake cabin would be referred to as a cottage, which sounds better, LOL.
July 1st, 2009 at 9:55 am
Long after I stopped reading Harlequins, I still bought Margaret Way’s books. Love the Australian setting. I’ve been to Ontario (which reminded me a lot of Wisconsin). If the plot and characters sounded interesting, I would buy a book no matter where it was set.
July 1st, 2009 at 9:55 am
Hi Cindy, thanks for the plug, and Happy Canada Day!
My experience is similar to yours. As a Canadian, when I started writing I heard two messages: (1) CanLit (literary fiction set in Canada) is prestigious but there’s not a huge market for it in the US; and (2) commercial fiction must have a US setting because US readers (by far our biggest audience) are only interested in reading about the States. Well, I’m not a literary writer and my goal is to make a living writing fiction so I had to pay attention to that second message, yet I thought it was crazy that Americans wouldn’t be interested in Canadian (and Australian, European, etc.) settings. I figured I’d write Canadian settings until an editor told me she’d buy my book if I changed the setting to the US, and then I’d see how I felt about it.
So I wrote Canadian settings, particularly Vancouver, BC, where I live. My books got rejected, but I don’t recall a single rejection that mentioned the setting. And when I sold (to Kensington), it was a 4-book series set in Vancouver. The Awesome Foursome series is kind of a romantic “Sex and the City” about four 20-something girlfriends, each of whom finds a sexy romance, and I’ve had lots of positive comments about the setting. Since then I’ve sold stories set in Canada, Australia, and Belize. I’ve had my Vancouver-set books translated into German, French, Spanish, and Portuguese. And the German romance magazine, LoveLetter, asked me to write an article on Awesome Vancouver, so clearly they figured the setting resonated with their readers.
I think setting depends partly on the line and type of story. Obviously, a Harlequin American Romance needs to be set in the US. The Presents line has a lot of stories set in Italy, Greece, etc. I write sexy contemporary romances that are character-driven and focus on relationships. In some of them, setting is pretty much irrelevant. In others, it’s a key factor (e.g., my Belize-set “Sex on the Beach” sure couldn’t take place anywhere other than the tropics!). I’m also writing a Wild Ride series for Kensington with each story taking a place on a journey: planes, trains, automobiles, and a cruise ship. So there, again, setting is key.
As a reader, I do love books that are set in my home town because it’s such fun recognizing places, but I also enjoy reading about different settings. I like it when the author gives a few interesting and colorful details of the setting, making me feel like I’m there – or want to be there! I’ve particularly enjoyed some of the women’s fiction set in Italy; you can almost feel the special quality of the Italian light, and almost taste the delicious food!
July 1st, 2009 at 10:24 am
Hey, Cindy!
I also read a Blaze set in Australia, but it had more of a flair for the local environment, and I enjoyed it immensely. I love reading the ‘jet setting’ locations of thrillers outside the United States, and I would be very open to Canada! I’ll be speaking in Toronto in August, so I’ll be curious to get that chapter’s take on “The Canadian Question” as well. I do admit, heroes coming from Australia or Canada just seem so much more innately rugged than homegrown ones… and that Australian accent is to die for!
Great blog post!
Jenn
July 1st, 2009 at 10:54 am
Hi, Cindy! I not only enjoy reading books set in Canada, but watching films set in Canada, too. I’m well aware that many programs are *filmed* in Canada these days, but few are set. The one that comes to mind where I felt Canada played a vital role is LARS AND THE REAL GIRL, not only in the landscape, but the super-friendly and accepting nature of the townspeople.
Anyway, yeah, more Canada in books AND films, please!
July 1st, 2009 at 10:59 am
I actually prefer books set outside the U.S. as long as they give a flavor of the country. Like Kelly said, I am very disappointed if a book is set in a foreign locale but you’d never know it. I want the author to transport me to that country. So given a choice I will usually pick a book with an international setting over a domestic one.
The books I’ve written have a mix of locales including Paris and Prague. My next one will be set in Ireland–cuz I’m doing extensive genealogy research there and I’m knee deep in Ireland info. Gotta put it to good use.
Great post Cindy!
Beth
July 1st, 2009 at 11:09 am
Hi Cindy~~
I’m another reader/writer that loves foreign settings. As a matter of fact I like them so much that my third mss is set in Austria. Older heroine finding true love. I love Europe but I love Canada too. I visited there just out of high school and was floored by its beauty.
Happy Canada Day!!
July 1st, 2009 at 11:14 am
Cindy, I was here yesterday to read the “Kids” blog… I didn’t know you were here, too! Cool!
I love reading romances set outside the U.S. Love learning new slang terms from other countries, love exploring new settings, love analyzing the differences AND the similarities in social thinking! For me, it’s like taking a fun trip w/o having to medicate myself and fly there. *G*
I wish publishers would stop putting readers in a box. So many of us do NOT want to keep buying the “same old, same old,” but they don’t give us that choice!
Readers want diversity! (At least this reader does!)
July 1st, 2009 at 11:17 am
I love reading novels set in different locations! My life goal is to some day see the world and write novels set in the various locations. currently all my books are set in Seattle. I love the Emerald City but my pen aches to travel
July 1st, 2009 at 11:28 am
Cindy,
What a great blog post! And yes, thanks for the mention! Happy Canada Day!
When I sold my first book to Kensington as a Precious Gem, my editor told me I’d have to change the setting from Canada to the US. The line had been inundated with Canadian authors and settings and Wal-Mart had stated that “American readers want American settings” and that they’d had complaints.
So, yes, I changed the setting. It was tough enough to sell so I didn’t see the sense in making it even harder on myself.
Your comment about HQ surprised me though. I’ve got a Blaze coming out in March set in the US and another proposal set in Canada is in right now. I asked about a Canadian set Blaze and they loved the idea. OK, here’s where I tell myself that it was the “idea” they love! LOL
Great post and if I can jump borders I will!
Bonnie Edwards
July 1st, 2009 at 11:41 am
Characters living out a plot in various parts of the world have always intrigued because they give me a chance to “be there.” I love finding out about the geography and climate, foods and culture, etc, especially when the story is set in Australia, Scotland or the Mediterranean. Parts of Africa are fascinating too.
July 1st, 2009 at 11:45 am
Hi, Cindy!
Over the years, my favorite novels have had settings that felt like another character in the story.
Some of my childhood favorites were Anne of Green Gables, The Swiss Family Robinson and Heidi. I’ve never actually been to Prince Edward Island, the Swiss Alps or a desert island, but even decades after reading those books, I feel as though I have.
It’s interesting (to me, at least!) that I’m now a Canadian author writing for Harlequin American Romance. The prerequisite is, of course, an American setting. My debut book was set in a fictional town in Connecticut, which I must confess is one state I’ve never actually visited, and the story even includes a Fourth of July picnic, which is something I’ve never actually attended!
Happy Canada Day!
Lee
July 1st, 2009 at 11:50 am
So good to read your take on this, Cindy! And to read your list of Canadian authors. Though I’m an American, I lived in Canada for a number of years and even set my 2008 RWA Golden Heart winner, THE DEVIL YOU KNOW, in Canada’s capital. Your post, and your readers’ comments, are keeping my hope alive! But I have to admit my latest WIP is set in the USA – LOL! Still, I love to read books with Canadian settings!
July 1st, 2009 at 12:11 pm
Happy Canada Day, Cindy! Count me as another reader who loves a bit of armchair travel. Bring on Italy, France and China (any time period), modern-day Australia, imperial Russia, and medieval England. One area sadly lacking: South America. I’d love to see more of Argentina and Brazil in particular.
July 1st, 2009 at 12:12 pm
I think this “books must be set in the US” thing is one of the many urban myths circulating throughout RWA. When I started to write, I too was told this as a fact by several experienced people, yet, every editor I’ve ever asked has said it doesn’t matter.
I suppose, like so many other things in writing and publishing, it depends on the execution.
It’s interesting that this happens in movies and TV, too. I’m thinking of Nia Vardalos’s My Big Fat Greek Wedding… which was the story of her life in Winnipeg, and was filmed in Toronto (bits in my neighbourhood — Hey, there’s Leo’s Meats!) and yet set in Chicago.
I read an interview of the creators of Flashpoint recently (watch it if you haven’t already) and how they keep trying to sneak more Canadianisms into that obviously Toronto based show (although they never say, Toronto… notice that?). The one they mentioned was constable. They have an ongoing fight with the US networks who air the show over the use of constable instead of officer. But they did get in Timmies and Double-Double and always refer to Toronto neighbourhoods by name, even if they never say Toronto.
July 1st, 2009 at 12:14 pm
Oh, and Kate Bridges is another Canadian romance writer who sets many of her historicals in Canada. Mounties. Yum.
July 1st, 2009 at 12:52 pm
I never thought about U.S. settings as one of the “romance rules”, but then I’ve never considered writing a story set anywhere but in the USA. After reading your blog, I can see how it might be a problem.
Laurie
July 1st, 2009 at 12:52 pm
Happy Canada Day!
I’m also living and writing in Canada, and not only have I set my current WIP north of the border, I’ve increased the complication by setting it in Montreal. Montreal is awesome, and it makes a fantastic setting for a story that addresses balance and compromise.
I love books set somewhere unfamiliar to me, like Ireland – Marian Keyes’ contemporary chick lit is my favorite.
I’ve read enough about New York, thanks – give me the underbelly of Saskatoon!
Sadly, I can only speak for what I like to read, and that may not be what sells. Hopefully/ideally if your story is fantastic and the Canadian setting works, then you’ll be breaking down that barrier and editors will be demanding more Canadian-based stories.
July 1st, 2009 at 1:10 pm
Happy Canada Day, Cindy.
I can’t give much of a gauge as for as American setting preferences because I’ll read a cereal box if there’s nothing else about. However, I do enjoy unique settings and have read books set all over the world. The Farenheit/Celcius, miles/kilometers etc., can throw me a loop (she’s doing 110! Oh, it km. Whew!), but overall, I think readers just want a good story.
July 1st, 2009 at 1:14 pm
I love books set in Canada. Especially ones in places I know
And honestly, if the story is compelling, I’ll read pretty much any setting! Whistler sounds like a great place to set a story!
The contemp book I’m working on is set in Vancouver and the Sunshine Coast – again, write what you know.
July 1st, 2009 at 1:47 pm
Hi everyone,
I had to go out for a Canada Day breakfast with the in-laws, my s-i-l, my niece, her dh, and the dh and my sons. Had a grand time. It’s a beautiful day here.
Edie, I haven’t spent time in Ontario, unless you count the airport and Ottawa, our capitol city. Such a big country! I’ve spent most of my time in B.C., where I was born, but when I was in grade 10 I was lucky enough to go on a school trip to Nova Scotia. We spent 3 days in Ottawa, then went on to Canso, Nova Scotia and also saw a bit of Cape Breton Island. Very beautiful there, too.
July 1st, 2009 at 1:55 pm
Hi Susan, thanks for dropping in, and you’re welcome for the plug.
Ah, CanLit. I LOVED CanLit in high school and university. I still do, but don’t have as much time to read it as I used to. I used to read CanLit almost exclusively. Yes, it’s totally okay to set Canadian literary novels in Canada. I think that’s why we writers get confused when we’re not writing literary and discover there’s a whole ‘nother set of “rules.” I was so glad when your Vancouver-set romances started selling. When readers respond positively to novels set in places other than the U.S., then the publishers are more apt to give other non-American-setting books more consideration.
Also, I began writing romance (as opposed to selling it, LOL) before I had access to the Internet. Now, with writers and readers connecting like never before, the world has gotten smaller. I think American readers are probably a lot more open to reading books set in other countries than publishers would have us believe. Of course, the dollar is the bottom line in publishing. If books set outside the U.S. don’t sell well, even if the reason for not selling has nothing to do with the setting, the publisher won’t be as likely to buy more non-American settings.
July 1st, 2009 at 1:59 pm
I love a good story, no matter where it’s set. Once I catch on to differences in idioms, I’m good to go.
July 1st, 2009 at 2:01 pm
Hi Jenn,
That’s cool that you’re speaking in Toronto. Let me know how it goes.
I think Hugh Jackman has done a whole lot for increasing the appeal of books set in Australia myself, LOL.
One of our ‘007 sisters, Bronwyn Parry, won the Golden Heart with her Australian-set novel, AS DARKNESS FALLS. She sold it to an Australian publisher. I was lucky enough to win it in a contest (I don’t think it’s available in North America), and Bronwyn did a great job of portrarying her country.
My dh’s cousins are Australian (his mom’s twin brother immigrated to Aus when she came to Canada from England), so I’ve been lucky enough to meet them a few times. We’ve yet to visit there but it’s in our plans. We have to hit Peru first (a long-time dream).
July 1st, 2009 at 2:03 pm
Hi, Tina, yes, you’re right, a LOT of films are made in Canada. Vancouver, B.C., for example, is known as “Hollywood North.” But it’s always a shocker for me, too, when the setting is actually Vancouver and not pretending to be Seattle or L.A. or wherever.
July 1st, 2009 at 2:06 pm
Beth, you make a good point. If the book is sold to an American publisher but is set outside the U.S., shouldn’t the setting transport the reader to that world? However, sometimes I think publishers are wary of allowing non-American authors to go too far. They don’t want the reading of the book to be too far out of a typical American reader’s experience. Just like some American-set romances don’t sell well to foreign markets because they are “too American,” maybe focusing on elements in that particular novel that readers in other countries wouldn’t find universal enough.
So, there’s a tricky balance.
July 1st, 2009 at 2:09 pm
Hi Caroline!
How cool that you’re setting a book in Australia!
When I was in university, it became quite the rage for Canadian students to take a year off and instead of traveling Europe (which is what I did), they would live and work in Australia. My best friend did that.
July 1st, 2009 at 2:11 pm
Great topic, Cindy!
I love books set in other countries, but I’ve heard the same things about manuscripts– contemporaries (especially category books) need to be set in the US, while historicals need to be set in England (preferably during the Regency period). I don’t know why this is– I know both my mom and I often pick up books set in foreign settings just because the location sounds interesting.
I live in the US, but I’ve traveled to Canada a number of times (and totally loved it– Via Rail kicks Amtrak’s butt!), and members of my family visit friends there regularly. I’d love to go to Australia. My father was there when he was in the Navy, and he loved it. Hmmm…. maybe I could make it a “research trip” for my next book?
Great post, Cindy!
July 1st, 2009 at 2:12 pm
Diana, I think you’re right. I think sometimes publishers don’t give readers enough credit. But it all comes down to business, doesn’t it? Publishing is a business. This is why trends suddenly glom the shelves only to disappear and not be seen again for a decade. The market and the readers become over-saturated with them.
And, yes, I’m here! I’m actually on the management team for this blog. The whole group has been working hard to get the blog going for the last year. It’s been a lot of work, but it’s been worth it.
I’m one of the people in charge of the scheduling. So I decided I’d give myself spot #13 in the line-up, because 13 is my favourite number. Lo and behold, I then discovered that day 13 in the blogging line-up was Canada Day. It was fate!
July 1st, 2009 at 2:15 pm
Hi Wendy,
Yes, Seattle and surrounding areas are usually my non-Canadian setting of choice. Seattle is pretty similar to Vancouver in terms of setting, so I can set a book in Seattle and it still can feel “familiar” enough that I feel qualified to write it.
I have great difficulty setting books in places I’ve never been. The Internet is great for research, but nothing provides the flavour for a novel like actually visiting the city (living in it is of course even better). This is why I love attending RWA National conferences. I always try to tack at least a couple days on either before or after the conference so I can get a better feel for the city and maybe set a story in it someday.
July 1st, 2009 at 2:18 pm
Now, I’m an American (proud Midwesterner
), but I *love* books set out of the U.S. I was an exchange student in Australia when I was in h.s. and have a partial draft of a romantic comedy set there. Another partial is set entirely in Europe. (Will have to finish writing those someday…) And, in my debut book, my main character goes on a trip to England, so I definitely enjoy a more international flavor!
July 1st, 2009 at 2:19 pm
Hey, Bonnie!
See, I think things have changed since you sold to Precious Gems and now having sold to Blaze. I think there’s much more openness now in HQ in setting books outside the U.S. than there might have been previously. And that’s great!
Like I said in my post, I’ve never had an editor, including one from Toronto, tell me my setting was a reason for rejection. I have a full manuscript with a Canadian setting under consideration with Harlequin/Silhouette right now, although it’s with the NYC office.
July 1st, 2009 at 2:23 pm
Hi Mary,
I confess, I do have a penchant for novels set in Canada. I love that sense of place that I can’t get from reading books set anywhere else. So I do understand where publishers and some portion of the U.S. readership is coming from. That said, for me it’s primarily the story. If the story intrigues me, it doesn’t matter where it’s set. But if I am transported to a different country, I do want to “experience” it through the novel.
July 1st, 2009 at 2:27 pm
Happy Canada Day, Lee!
I think it’s cool that you’re a Canadian writing for American Romance. The feeling of that line is small town U.S., and frankly if you’ve ever lived in small town Canada, the feeling isn’t all that different. So a Canadian writer should be able to write American small town romances and still feel at home – just stop the metric system from creeping into the storyline, LOL.
Although, up here, we’re pretty much versed in both. I talk in feet to my kids, not metres, because it was feet when I attended elementary school and I haven’t been successful in translating over. However, I talk Celsius when it comes to temperature, and litres when it comes to gas or milk, and kilometres when it comes to mileage. I CALL it mileage. Like, “I’m recording my mileage for the day.” “How far did you go?” “Oh, 30 klicks.” (klicks = kilometres).
July 1st, 2009 at 2:29 pm
Christa, that’s excellent that you set your GH winner in Ottawa. Crossing everything for you! Yes, never give up hope.
July 1st, 2009 at 2:40 pm
Hi Shelley and Maureen, my fellow Bond Girl sisters.
Shelley, I plan to have an Argentinian hero in a future erotic short for my pen name. Will that do?
But the story itself is planned to be set in Vancouver, as his wife is Canadian.
Maureen, yes, half of me wonders if the “set it in the U.S.” thing IS a myth, but when you have an agent telling you to move the setting to the U.S., or, as in Bonnie Edwards’ case, having an editor tell you to change the setting to make the sale…the myth started from somewhere…
I don’t watch Flashpoint – thanks for the recommendation and also for including Kate Bridges’s website.
Mentioning Canadianisms, we also have to remember regionalisms. My pen name set one of her stories in California, and I already knew from traveling in the U.S. that if I walked into McDonald’s in DC, for example, and asked for a pop, I’d get a laugh. It was called soda (I believe). So I wrote a friend in California and asked, do you call it pop or soda or soda pop? She emailed back, “it’s soft drink.” Yikes, another one to add to the mix.
July 1st, 2009 at 2:45 pm
Laurie, if I were American I probably wouldn’t consider setting a story outside of the States, either, unless I wanted to set it in Europe or something. It definitely wouldn’t occur to me, as an American, to set a book in Canada. Write what you know (and love). I think that’s the struggle that a lot of non-American romance writers face. We love writing romances, but the *market* for romances is largely the States. Yes, one of the biggest romance publishers in the world is Canadian, but way more Americans than Canadians write for Harlequin, and the American readership is giant compared to the Canadian readership. Our population, if not our geography, is so much smaller. That’s where it can become an issue for some Canadian writers, such as myself.
July 1st, 2009 at 2:51 pm
Karen, yes, you’ve definitely increased the complication by setting your story in Montreal. Quebec is like it’s own entity within Canada, and the country is so vast that those of us living in the West don’t always understand central Canada or the Maritimes, and vice versa. I think it’s excellent that you’re doing so, though. Keep at it!
One of my best friends as a kid was born in Montreal. She lived in B.C. for several years and spoke what I called “Franglais” with her parents. Mainly French with some English tossed in. She spoke English at school, but her name, Line, caused her no end of hassle. The teachers always called her “line” (long I). We called her Lynn, but really it’s pronounced more like “lean,” (as in Celine Dion).
I’ve always wanted to visit Montreal and Quebec City. When my friend moved back to Montreal after high school, her father stayed here. Line would bring back her Montreal-born boyfriend, and I was shocked that he didn’t know a word of French. He was an English-speaking born Quebecois.
She was similarily surprised that we had French on our shampoo bottles and cereal boxes, etc., because, she said, they only had French on the shampoo bottles in Quebec. She’d called her hair her “hairs,” and we’d tease her. I had so much fun with her (and still do the rare time I see her).
July 1st, 2009 at 2:55 pm
Gwynlyn, LOL, the kilometres still throw me for a loop, don’t worry. Because we live so close to the U.S. and the American culture is so pervasive through TV, music and movies, even teenagers today, who were born and raised with the metric system, are still half-familiar with the, gosh, I can’t even remember what’s it called, British Imperial System? Pounds and gallons and Fahrenheit, etc.
80 km/hour = 50 miles an hour. It sounds like we’re flying down the highway but we’re not.
July 1st, 2009 at 2:56 pm
Teresa, way to go on setting your book on the Sunshine Coast. I would love to read a book in that setting. So uniquely British Columbian.
July 1st, 2009 at 2:58 pm
Hi Mary,
I think the differences in idioms might be one of the reasons publishers have shied away from books set outside the U.S. or the non-American authors, like myself, will try to Americanize as much as makes sense. That’s why I’ll write, “It’s freezing outside,” rather than give any sort of temperature in Celsius. “Freezing” is universal. But if you say, It’s “2 below Zero,” in Celsius that’s nowhere near as cold as in Fahrenheit. 32 degrees Fahrenheit = app. zero Celsius.
July 1st, 2009 at 3:00 pm
Laura, yes, go do “research” in Australia. You need an assistant, don’t you?
That assistant can be me!
July 1st, 2009 at 3:01 pm
Cindy, you sure know how to make my head hurt with all this thinking
As an American, I love reading about other countries; love reading books set in Canada, Australia, Ireland, England, Wales and more. Don’t you think that might have been the popularity of Georgette Heyer when her historicals became the rage in America. For a while in the States, Westerns weren’t selling.
My overseas Critique Partner wrote a book originally captioned To the Ends of the Earth. It was and is still my favorite of his work. I took my globe and followed his action adventure with my finger. Wow, what an experience and an education. Keep those out-of-American settings coming. I consider you an education!
July 1st, 2009 at 3:02 pm
Hi Marilyn!
An exchange student to Australia? What a wonderful opportunity. Here, at the high school my sons both went to, the exchange trips are to Japan (as part of the Japanese language program, if you don’t want to take French). My youngest took Japanese instead of French, but he didn’t do the exchange trip, because he had to choose between that and remaining in the concert band so he could go to Disneyland in grade 11. They do a Disneyland trip (playing in a square there) every three years. I chaperoned, and it was a blast.
July 1st, 2009 at 3:04 pm
Thanks, Donnell, I will – although I don’t want to make your head hurt, LOL.
July 1st, 2009 at 3:41 pm
Hey Cindy!
I never choose books based on setting, so I won’t shun you for writing Canadian. In fact, I’d love to visit Canada someday, soon if possible. Feel better?
July 1st, 2009 at 3:44 pm
Avery, I’ll feel better when you start paying my way to visit Texas!
July 1st, 2009 at 4:02 pm
Hi Cindy,
Great topic! As a Canadian writer, I too have struggled with location. One of my novellas is set in West Vancouver and an editor thought I had invented it. Um, no, it’s a real place. In fact, most of my stories are set in Canada, but often I make the area sound generic enough or I don’t actually specify so it could be anyplace North America. My stories aren’t necessarily setting driven, they are usually character driven.
However, an ms I have out to agents right now is set in my suburban location here in BC. And I use Canadian/British spelling. I worry if that will hurt my chances. The place could easily be switched to Washington, but there is a line about how the heroine probably scared off all the animals in so many States and she replies “We’re not in the States.” If they feel strongly about it (that’s hoping they even like the book) I can certainly change it. But, I hope they don’t.
Personally, I like books that are set all over the place. Britain, US, Australia and Europe. But, I get a special joy out of reading Canadian settings. Especially ones I’m very familiar with. I’ve read Eileen Cook’s first book and some of Susan Lyons’ books and loved being able to picture exactly where the characters were.
July 1st, 2009 at 4:41 pm
Hi Michelle,
I used to write with Canadian spelling, but then I changed my word processing program to American spelling default for my book files. It just makes it so much easier, I think, when you’re subbing to an American publisher, because even if they like that your setting is in Canada, if house style is American spelling, the copy editing experience could be intense.
I have a personal writing blog – if anyone wants to check it out it’s at http://www.museinterrupted.com, and I’ve become so accustomed to writing my books in “American,” that I write my blog posts in American, too. (Plus, I think the spell checker for the blog is American). But I write my comments in Canadian! Litre, theatre, colour, travelling – yippee, I love to see those extra letters and especially the mixed up ones, LOL.
Good luck with your book, and LOL on West Vancouver being fictional.
July 1st, 2009 at 5:39 pm
Nice topic, Cindy. It seems the publishing industry has come a long way since then. They seem to love exotic settings these days.
Both my agent and editor liked my debut effort, THE DOWRY BRIDE, because it is set in India. The second book, THE FORBIDDEN DAUGHTER, was also set in India. Strangely, my editor was a bit skeptical about the setting for the third book, THE SARI SHOP WIDOW, since it’s Edison, New Jersey. Nonetheless, I convinced her that the Indian culture bit that she likes so much is very strong in this story as well, despite its American backdrop. So the ms was accepted and will be published on Sept 1, 2009.
Thanks for bringing this up in your blog.
Shobhan Bantwal
July 1st, 2009 at 5:42 pm
That’s excellent, Shobhan. Congratulations!
We have a pretty big Indian-immigrant population in my province, so to me a novel with an Indo-Canadian heroine would be totally at home here.
July 1st, 2009 at 6:34 pm
Great post, Cindy! I love reading books set in different settings. And since I’ve never been to Canada, I would love to read about it. I had no idea that 36 celsius equaled nearly 100 degrees farhenheit! Thanks for the lesson!
July 1st, 2009 at 6:42 pm
I’m sure I’m in the minority, but I just don’t care where my novels are set. Europe, Canada, Chicago, BFE Indiana–it’s all the same to me. But I agree that people tend to harp about setting. I’ve been told all sorts of “rules” from how you should set it in a recognizable locale to the “rule” that a book set in Florida won’t sell (huh?). I dunno!
July 1st, 2009 at 6:46 pm
You’re welcome, Theresa. Celsius is tricky. Zero Celsius = 32 degrees Fahrenheit but there’s a point where you’re saying, “It’s 20 below” or something, and whether it’s in Celsius or Fahrenheit, it’s the same.
Okay, now I’ll drive myself crazy if I don’t find out WHAT that point is. Off to google…
I’m back. 40 degrees below zero is the same no matter if you’re using Celsius or Fahrenheit.
20 below zero F = 28 below C.
80 Fahrenheit = 27 C. Excellent, now I know why it’s such a nice, balmy day today. It’s 80 F. I think I like 80 F.
100 F = 38 Celsius. Where I live, it’s not uncommon for summers to reach 42 Celsius, or even 46 if we’re having a bad heat wave. That’s 108 F and 115 F respectively. Yikes, no wonder I begged for A/C several years ago.
July 1st, 2009 at 6:47 pm
So, when you’re singing the song:
“It’s 40 below and I don’t give a f*ck, gotta heater in my truck, and it’s off to the rodeoooooooo!”
… you could be talking Canada or the U.S., LOL.
July 1st, 2009 at 7:06 pm
Please tell me I’m not too late to be in it to win you book. PLs, pls, pls. I’m in Aussie land and can never get the time thing right. I am currently unpubbed but with 3 nevels. I guess I’m a hedger!!!! I have one set in NY/Cape Cod, one set in Oz/Positano. I think there is something glamerous about those places. (Never got that feeling about any Australian setting until I read Bron Parry’s As Darkness Falls. I’m now in love with my own country LOL. As a result my third novel is set in Australia – in fact not far from where I love (regional east coast). Now about that prize book of yours !!!!!!!
July 1st, 2009 at 7:23 pm
er, Austria.
July 1st, 2009 at 7:30 pm
Hey, Leshia.
A book set in Florida won’t sell? That’s a new one on me.
I think the key is, if your setting is important to your book, to make it come alive.
July 1st, 2009 at 7:32 pm
Jenn, you’re not too late, don’t worry. It’s only 4:30 in my part of Canada. I’m choosing the winner by random draw tomorrow morning, so check back then, as I’ll announce the name in this comment thread.
Hey, thanks for pointing out the spelling of Oz. I never know whether to spell Aus or Oz. Now I know.
Caroline, sheesh, I stand corrected. I can’t believe my eyes saw Australia instead of Austria. Must be my little Hugh Jackman obssession.
July 1st, 2009 at 8:06 pm
Re spelling Oz. Not sure what the other Aussies think about this, but maybe you’d best stick to Aus (as in Aussie) Oz is just my little play on it being a magical place to live (as in the Wizard and the Emerald city). Sorry to confuse.
July 1st, 2009 at 8:13 pm
Gotcha, Jenn.
July 1st, 2009 at 8:28 pm
I love books that are set outside of the United States and I REALLY want your Canadian set romantic comedy. PLEASE draw my name, Cindy. Thank you!
July 1st, 2009 at 8:39 pm
Hi Alynn,
I feel hypnotized… Draw Alynn’s name, draw Jenn’s name… draw Alynn…draw Jenn….
Seriously, thanks for dropping by, Alynn, my CL buddy.
July 1st, 2009 at 10:42 pm
Happy Canada Day, Cindy, and to all the other Canadians visiting here!
I love reading books set in different places, especially when written by someone who knows and loves the place. I think the different cultural ‘voices’ often go beyond just differences in spelling and language, and I love absorbing the culture and the subtleties of cultural expression.
However, I can attest to the fact that non-US settings can be a hard sell to US publishers. As you’ve mentioned, Cindy, and Jenn McLeod as well, my GH-winning book, AS Darkness Falls, hasn’t yet got a US publisher – although it has garnered quite a few ‘nice’ rejections. There could be a few reasons for that though, beyond just the setting of edge-of-the-outback Australia. In writing it, I purposely didn’t try to ‘romanticise’ the setting; this is not a book full of stockmen with rippling muscles on gorgeous horses (the hero is a city guy), and there’s little in the way of furry wildlife – in fact, the only kangaroo is a dead one! So, the tone of it, and the fact that it’s not a red-hot suspense, may not be appealing to US publishers.
I’m keeping my fingers crossed, though, that we may yet find a US publisher – but I’m not holding my breath, particularly in the current economic climate. It comes out in the UK in September, so it will be interesting to see how it goes there. Although they haven’t mentioned the Australian setting on the cover, as that’s apparently not a big selling point over there.
I’ll just keep writing the Australian settings though, as long as my publisher here wants to publish them!
July 1st, 2009 at 10:49 pm
Cindy, I read a chick lit book back about 6 years ago… The Journal of Mortifying Moments by Robyn Harding.
I knew about 10 pages in the author was Canadian, even though the setting was in the US. The character not only referred to Saskatoon berries… she ate butter tarts.
I met Robyn a few years later and we were laughing about it. She had no idea those were things unique to Canada until I commented about it in my review of her book on my blog. But I’m sure only Canadians noticed these things.
I’ve heard a few people have editors and agents ask them to change their settings, too… But one of my CP’s just had her agent ask her to do the opposite… Her agent thought the Canadian setting of her first book (which sold at auction) was one of the things that made her voice special.
July 1st, 2009 at 11:47 pm
Bron, the fact there there are no stockmen with rippling muscles makes As Darkness Falls a story with characters that you can really relate to and I think THAT is what makes a book a good read. (We are not a land of Hugh Jackmans – sorry ladies, but it’s true LOL).When I do read stories full of glamourous people I turn off – it’s not real. Bron, I for one am glad your characters are real (and still gorgeous). I’ve never read a novel twice in my life, but I am reading ADF again just now. Love it!
July 1st, 2009 at 11:47 pm
Hi Bronwyn,
Glad you could make it! I certainly hope you find a U.S. publisher for AS DARKNESS FALLS. One of the things I liked about it so much was just what you say – you didn’t romanticize the Australian setting. It felt soooooo real.
July 1st, 2009 at 11:50 pm
Maureen, what do you mean butter tarts are uniquely Canadian? LOL, I had no idea. Is this like salt ‘n vinegar chips. I’ll never forget the first time I went to the States and couldn’t find my “S&Vs.” Or when I asked for vinegar in a restaurant to go with my French fries, and I was given cider vinegar. Sorry, I want white vinegar!
That’s so cool about your cp!! That’s the kind of story I love to hear!
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:34 am
It’s after midnight blog time, so I’m going to go ahead and announce that Linda (commenter #2) won the draw for the free trade paperback copy of HEAD OVER HEELS. Congratulations, Linda! Please email your mailing address to my attention at cindy AT cindyprocter-king DOT com, and I’ll get the book off in the mail to you ASAP. Remember to spell Procter with an E and include the hyphen.
Thanks, everyone, for sharing my Canada Day and your thoughts on non-American romance novel settings with me.